061: Rachel Rodgers – Simple & Consistent: How To Build an 8-Figure Business

[00:00:00] Rachel:
Don’t partner with somebody because you feel like you’re a small fry. Don’t give your stuff away. What I should have done is an affiliate relationship. Instead I made it a partnership, and that was a mistake.

Have confidence and make sure you own your stuff. Trust me, today maybe it’s not worth anything, nobody knows your name, but in a couple of years, if you’re consistent with it, people will know you and it will be making you bank.

[00:00:33] Nathan:
In this episode I talk to Rachel Rodgers. Rachel is an attorney turned business coach, and she’s someone I’ve admired and respected for a long time. We’ve been friends for about four or five years. I’ve watched her transform her legal practice into a products business, helping small business owners understand contracts and be protected legally, all the way through into her coaching business owners that want to scale their business.

I love how she always challenges me on diversity and inclusion, and how we talk about racism and so much more. We actually did a small business town hall about a year and a half ago on the topic of ending racism in the workplace and using businesses as a force for good.

She invited me on that, and we’ve done a lot of things together since then. Rachel was just a ton of fun, and she’s brilliant at business. She’s just kind of my hero because of the way that she approaches scaling a massive and successful business, and thinks about brand and everything else.

I’m going to have a ton of fun doing this interview.

So with that, I hope you enjoy this episode.

Rachel, welcome to the show.

[00:01:45] Rachel:
Thank you so much for having me. I’m glad we’re doing this.

[00:01:49] Nathan:
Yeah. There’s so much that I want to talk about, but going back, I was thinking about when the first time we hung out. I think it was Mastermind Talks.

[00:01:59] Rachel:
Yes.

[00:02:00] Nathan:
Where was that? It was in California somewhere, somewhere beautiful. Carmel?

[00:02:03] Rachel:
Yes. Was it? I can’t remember. I don’t remember where it was.

[00:02:10] Nathan:
Hanging out at a beautiful place in California at the Mastermind Talks conference.

You had a different business than I feel like you do now. Are you in the process of transitioning it?

What were you working on at that time? Maybe four years ago? Five years ago?

[00:02:26] Rachel:
That’s probably when the transition started.

I started out as a lawyer. In 2010, I graduated from law school. In 2009, I clerked for a judge for a year. I was clerking for the judge. It’s a one-year thing, and then you’re asked to leave because the new clerks are coming in.

It’s a prestigious position to work for a judge, and it buys you some time. You can use that year to decide, “Alright, where am I going with this career next?” I applied to lots of positions, and I also started thinking about becoming an entrepreneur and starting my own practice.

And. You know, ultimately decided I hated the idea of working for anybody. And so on September 1st, 2010, I started my law practice. and you know, my, my clients were entrepreneurs because I had a lot of friends that was during the 2008 recession. A lot of people were, you know, losing their jobs, but getting severance packages and using those packages.

Cause while I was in law school, they were in corporate jobs. So they would get these severance packages and start a business. And so I started, you know, doing the legal work for them, setting up their LLC, setting up their contracts, you know, all of that kind of stuff. and so that’s how I started my practice and worked with entrepreneurs for six or seven years.

And then discovered that I really love selling. I really love marketing. I really love running a business. I do not so much love practicing law. And so that was a transition period. And of course I couldn’t just leave cause I was the sole provider for my family. So, and have. Four kids now, but at the time it was three.

And so, you know, I slowly just started dabbling with business coaching and teaching because a lot of people would come to me and say like, my clients would ask me, how is your business making so much money? Like, what are you doing? And I’m like, oh, are you not making the same money? That’s how I figured out I was making a lot of money.

Cause I didn’t think it was a lot.

[00:04:15] Nathan:
People’s reaction.

[00:04:18] Rachel:
Exactly, exactly. And at the time, you know, I think I, you know, was transitioning out of my law practice and we had had around 700,000 was where we were at. And so then I started moving into business coaching and I took one client on and she was at like, let’s say a hundred grand and then grew her business to, you know, like half a million in a very short period of time.

And I was like, oh, I am good at this. So then I started doing it and she told everybody under the sun. And so she, you know, more people came to me. And so I was like business coaching was my side hustle, but my real job was practicing law still. Cause that’s what paid the bills. and so it was like a two year transition period.

Taking less and less legal clients and really not advertising law anymore because I was already known for it. I already had enough like repeat customers, you know? So what I was advertising was the business coaching and getting new clients coming in that way. and so it was like a slow transition. And then I also had a digital product, small business bodyguard.

So that kind of helped I could do a launch whenever I needed to, to kind of buoy cash if I wanted to not take a legal client on. but it w it took me a while. Like a lot of people are just like, oh, quit, whatever. And I think if you don’t have dependents, maybe that’s an option. But for me, I, yeah, exactly.

I couldn’t just walk away. And so I had to do a transition and I think it was good actually, because a lot of the. Intellectual property. A lot of the audience, they sort of went with me, you know, into business coaching, not everybody, but a lot of them. So a lot of my former legal clients then became actual clients of my business.

So it took a little while. And then like, I think when I met you, I was on sort of, or when we met in person for the first time, I was sort of on the tail end of that transition and, you know, fully, mostly, you know, You know, you start out and you’re like, 80% of my money is coming from my day job. Right.

Which was practicing law and 20% from business coaching. And then it sort of slowly transitions until now it’s 80% business coaching and only the 20% left is the legal clients that I just can’t get rid of. And I just have to finish up the work, you know? it was that kind of thing. And I had done, you know, I’m selling VIP days, I’m selling one-on-one, I’m selling group classes, am selling retreats.

I was doing everything and driving myself insane and exhausted. And so I was like, okay, I have to stop this and create a brand that’s cohesive and focused and like one main offer. and so that’s when I was like, starting to launch Hello Seven and really focusing on this is, this is who I want to serve.

[00:06:47] Nathan:
So there’s a lot in there. And especially, I want to talk about the brand for coaching, because a lot of people don’t do that. And I think that’s why a lot of people run very small businesses compared to, oh, what you have before that? I want to talk about a small business bodyguard, because that was the first time I think that I’d seen someone brand and like, was it all products or was there like productized services in that, in the offering?

[00:07:11] Rachel:
No. When it launched, it was, I mean, man, the good old days back when it was just a pure digital product and you didn’t do crap, you know, it’s like, what’s, the product is not all you gotta do is sell it and walk away. No Facebook group, no Q and A’s no nothing. so really it was a standalone product and, you know, I offered nothing in addition to it.

And so that part, it started off, I think when I first launched it was 2 95 and then it grew over time until like $1,100. But yes, I feel like that was an idea I had because I had taught a class. You know, when I was practicing law because a lot of entrepreneurs couldn’t afford me. So I was like, well, what if I just taught them the basics of what they need to do at least like to get started?

And I could do that in a class format. I think it’s fun to teach. I think it’s fun to explain these more complex concepts to people in a way that is easy to understand. I enjoy that process. So I did it and I had like, let’s say 10 or 15 people in the class. It was not that many people. it didn’t make me that much money, And it was also like the worst part of it was, it was really boring. I was like, I was boring myself in my lectures, you know what I mean? and so I was like, by the end of it, I think it was like, let’s say six classes over a six week period. And by the end of it, I was like, this is really good content, but this format sucks, you know?

And so then I was like, well, how could I make, what if I made it fun and funny? Cause that’s what I was doing in like my emails or in some of my marketing, I would try to make it entertaining. I, you know, I don’t, hopefully I’m not a boring person. So I was taking this like boring concept right. And making it interesting for people.

And so, you know, I was like, I think I need to turn this into a product that does that. And so that’s how the idea for small business bodyguard came about where it was just as irreverent and hilarious as I am in real life, in the actual product and the copy of the product. So, you know, it’s, you know, a 200 page like guide that’s teaching you about contracts and is really.

You know, based on legit experience, but it’s also gonna make you laugh out loud, as well. So that did really well. I mean that killed it. You know, there’s something about entertainment. I think.

[00:09:23] Nathan:
Can you share some numbers in that?

[00:09:25] Rachel:
Oh, yes. I mean, I can’t remember. I mean, we served thousands of clients, probably 3000, at least, if not more than that.

And that product made me well over a million dollars in the, like, let’s say three to five years that I was marketing it, you know? I think it was less than five years. Honestly, those last two years I was barely. So I was like, it was just like, it was up and it would sell, but I did no work, but the three years that I was really pushing it, it made, you know, a million dollars.

So it did quite well at the initial launch. I made 80 and I partnered with somebody who I later wound up having a lawsuit with, but she had a list. And so I thought I needed her because she had a mailing list and my list was pretty small. and it was just a confidence thing I think. And this is something that I think people need to hear is that don’t partner with somebody.

Cause you feel like you’re a small fry, like don’t give your stuff away. ‘cause, you know, if you’re just patient or do a partnership, like what I should have done is an affiliate relationship. And instead I made it a partnership and that was a mistake. so I would say, you know, have the confidence, make sure you own your stuff, because trust me today, maybe it’s not worth anything.

Nobody knows your name, but in a couple of years, if you’re consistent with it, people will know you and it will be making you bank.

And you’ll be pissed that you’re handing over a check for 50% of your profits to somebody who’s not putting in the same effort as you, you know? so that’s something to take away from this, but yeah, I mean, that product did so well and really supplemented my income and really built my audience.

And I got a lot of legal clients from it as well. Cause people would do some of the things themselves for a while and then they’d be like, okay, I’ve grown enough. Or I’ve run into a place where I don’t want to do this by myself anymore. So now I’m going to become a client. So it exponentially grew my practice.

[00:11:07] Nathan:
Yeah, I think that that sort of products Like that are really, really good. and I think it just elevated your brand so much. I think another thing that if I remember correctly, people really like to buy it because you have lots of sample contracts in it and you had, is that right? That you had details of like, oh, you know, use this as a starting point for, you know, IP assignment or for, you know, this contractor agreement or whatever.

[00:11:31] Rachel:
Exactly. It was useful. Like all of the contract templates, like independent contractor agreement, employment agreement, step-by-step on how to register a copyright, you know, everything you need just to know about, you know, having terms and conditions and a privacy policy on your website. So it’s like, I was educating people, I’m making it fun to learn and then giving them the actual formula.

But I wanted to not just give them a template because they don’t know what the hell they’re doing. They don’t know why these clauses are there. They don’t actually know what they’re agreeing to. So I really wanted to explain what here’s, what it is. Here’s why it’s in there. And then now here’s the formula to make it easy to plug and play, you know?

And people loved that. I mean, just make something useful, you know, like this whole, it is if it’s useful and especially if you’re entertaining in the process, that’s going to kill.

[00:12:16] Nathan:
Yeah. I remember with, my book authority in one of the higher packages, I had a 90 day launch. And that was like, the thing that people wanted the most was like the exact, like do this on this day. Okay. You want to launch on September 1st? Like here’s the work backwards? And I was just blown away that the, the like tangible, you know, that the template or the, exact thing, like that was what people wanted.

Just as much as they wanted the, you know, like narrative, you know, educational content.

[00:12:48] Rachel:
Exactly. And you know why, because if you don’t know how to do that one, you’re either guessing. And so you’re like I don’t know how well this is going to work. I have a hunch, let me try it and see what happens. Right. And, or the alternative is you have to hire an expert. Who’s Like a consultant. Who’s going to cost you thousands of dollars.

So they see the value in that of like, oh, give me this plug and play formula. and I think that’s such a huge way in, and I mean, that’s what we do in my membership community. Now that’s a big part of it is like giving them, I’m like, give them the thing, make it easy. It’s like tell them what the thing is explained to them.

So they understand it at a high level and they sort of are learning the strategy, but then also give them the easy way to do it. Like one of the best things that people absolutely are obsessed with is we give them like 15 scripts to make money. So like to negotiate, you know, To negotiate something to, you know, get a new client, to go back to an old client and say, Hey, do you want to work with me again?

To negotiate with your roommates, the tours in the household, you know, it’s like we have so many different formulas and it’s like all in email or script form, and people are obsessed with that’s because, and it’s like, it was a free bonus, you know, but people absolutely love it because it’s just make it easy for them to take the thinking out.

There’s so much to manage these days. It’s like, make it easy for me, you know?

[00:14:05] Nathan:
Right. Give me the play by play of exactly what to do. Okay. So let’s fast forward for a second. You’ve got Hello Seven right now. And it’s a wildly different business. As far as the scale, the types of products, like give everyone a run down on, you know? the business model and then any numbers that you’re okay with sharing.

[00:14:24] Rachel:
Yeah. so hello. Seven is we exceeded eight figures last year, so that was our first eight figure year. which is very exciting. And, thank you. I feel like it’s a, it’s a big milestone, you know? I think it’s just important to share it because people don’t think it’s possible. They think certain business models, you can only grow to a certain point.

And so I’m glad that it’s doing that. and, so hello. Seven is all about helping, you know, entrepreneurs that are historically and systemically marginalized build wealth. Right? We are. the majority. folks who are starting businesses today are women. they are people of color, queer people, people living with disabilities.

So like basically, you know, most entrepreneurial communities you join and, you know, everybody’s a white guy and they’re not necessarily as nice as you naked, you know, and as aware as you are. and so, you know, you go to a place and you’re the token everywhere you go. And so I’m like, you will not be the only anything in this space.

You will not be the only non-binary person in this space. You will not be the only black person in this space, you know, and that is huge for people. And on top of that, we offer, you know, legitimate business coaching and training, teaching people how to build a business from zero to seven figures. so that’s what we do.

And the main way that we do that is through a membership program called the club. We should all be millionaires the club and, it has, what are we at 2,600 members. I want to say at the moment, And yeah, it’s just, it’s done real well. People love the community. They love the training. We have amazing coaches. I mean, that is that’s the business model. That’s it? It’s simple.

[00:16:06] Nathan:
A lot of people will think about coaching, right. And it’s just the one-on-one coaching of, maybe they’re starting somewhere that they’re like, yeah, I’ll do coaching for a hundred dollars an hour, you know, or, or they’ll have some crazy idea in their head of like, I’ll do coaching for $300 an hour and they play that forward.

And nowhere in that, like the conclusion of their idea of coaching is it. Eight figure business even $10 million or more a year in revenue. And so what are the things where you’re going, okay, hold on. You think of coaching and you think of this. I think of coaching and here’s how, like it’s a, a real scalable business rather than the side of, I was gonna say just trading time for money trading time for money is not a bad thing.

[00:16:48] Rachel:
It’s not a bad thing.

[00:16:49] Nathan:
Yeah, but it’s, it’s, not, it reaches its limits and scale. So I’m, I’m curious how, you had to change your thinking in order to, you know, turn this into a, an eight figure business.

[00:17:02] Rachel:
Yeah. I mean, honestly, when hello, seven began, I was thinking of it as something that was scalable, you know, beyond what I could imagine. And so, you know, because I had done the VIP days, the retreats, the one-on-ones, the groups and all of the different coaching things that you could sell. I have done it. I have tried it.

I have packaged it in that way and my clients got results, but I saw that it was going to really limit me. Right. Especially here’s the other thing. I was selling seven different things, you know? I had to constantly be educating my client about what’s this thing now, you know, whereas if you stick with one thing, you can be known for that one thing.

And you’re constantly talking about that one thing. And so they know exactly what you do. They know how you do it, they know who you do it for. And so they just have to decide, do I want it now or not? You know? And that’s it versus having to constantly reeducate people on now, where are you selling? You know?

And so that’s why I’m a big advocate for really limiting the number of offers. And it’s so funny, you know, we talk about Twitter a lot and Twitter is like my safe space where I go to hang out. I don’t really do a whole lot of marketing there, but on Twitter I posted something that was like, you know, more hobbies, less offers and it got no traction.

And I’m just like this, this is a revolutionary concept that will change your life. And no, like they’re like, no, we want a thousand offers, forget hobbies, all the offers in them, because I think entrepreneurs get bored and they create another offer. And I’m like, please stop. Because actually that offer, let’s say that offer is going to make you another 50 grand.

Cool. Could you have made that 50 grand with the offer that you already have and would it be easier? Cause you already got testimonials. You already got the sales page. Why are we starting from scratch all the time? Right. And I think it’s a lack of confidence where we’re like, well, let’s try this thing.

We were just like throwing everything at the wall until we think something sticks and there’s a time and a place for that in the early days. But at some point I think you really have to narrow down on a main offer. And that’s what I saw. Like I saw the trend being the entrepreneurs that really seem to be having.

Huge success really had much less that they were selling either one, maybe two offers, you know, like Denise Duffield-Thomas is a perfect example. She’s been selling one thing. The same thing for ever, you will never like you, you, no one doesn’t know what Denise sells.

If you know her, you know what she sells because she’s been doing it forever.

And so, and you know, someone that’s that’s taken that program. Right. Like, and so I think there’s a lot of benefit to that. And I think when we get bored, we should, you know, start riding horses, start a farm like you and I have done like, find something else to do for entertainment. Stop creating offers for entertainment, because it actually hurts your profits, in the long run.

[00:19:45] Nathan:
I’ve explained this to people and listening to podcasts for awhile has, has heard me say this, talk about, like building wealth or building businesses as, like a shopping mall or a strip mall versus a skyscraper. And it’s exactly what you’re saying of like, okay, I have this piece of land, so I’m gonna, you know, I, I built this thing.

It’s my little radio shack or whatever. It’s got 200 grand in revenue, you know, I’m gonna do this other one. So let me add this next to it. I got a subway next to it Now it’s 75 grand revenue and you’re just going around, you have all this versus what you’ve done with hello, seven, where you’re just like, forget all of that This is just a skyscraper. We’re just building up the same thing. Every bit of effort and momentum goes into how do we make this better? You know, how do we level it up? and yeah, I love it.

[00:20:31] Rachel:
Hello, seven actually started with my first main offer was a mastermind. And so that’s what I was selling. And it only had like, let’s say 50 people in it. And 50 people was out. I can’t remember the exact numbers, but it was over a million dollar, you know, seven figure business, with 50 people on our mastermind.

And that was all we sold. and we would do, like, we would do a live event. So we had like a traveling live event. This was pre COVID, where, you know, it would be like a one day event. And at that event I would promote the mastermind to anyone who wanted to join. So that was a good marketing and it was like, it generated a little bit of money, but not much.

And it led to the mastermind and that was the main thing we sold and then COVID hit and. People were scared to invest that much into a mastermind and coaching, especially when there was so much uncertainty about business. And depending on the industry that my clients were in, they might be in an industry that was hit really bad, or they might be in an industry where there’s just a lot of uncertainty.

And so during that time I had to really rethink the business model. And so I was like, well, you know what. And honestly, I think they’re almost the exact same masterminds and memberships. It’s just the number of people in it, right? Like one is a larger community. and one, you know, you have to, if you’re going to do something at scale, you have to find a way to solve for some of the problems that come with having a lot of people, you know, like how do I make these coaching calls super valuable to everybody when we have people at different revenue levels on this call, right?

Like, and so you have to solve for some of these problems, but that’s, so I was like, I have an incredible coaching team. I have a great team. We have great marketing. We have an amazing audience and we have all of this content, some of the content we had just filmed in January. So it was like unreleased.

And so I’m like, you know what. We have so many rabid fans of our podcast that we’re like, I really want to work with you, but I can’t afford to join the mastermind. And so we were like, you know what, let’s try membership. And I have to say, I hated memberships. I used to poopoo them. I’d be like, don’t start a membership.

It’s the worst. I thought it was the worst business model ever. And then of course that’s what I wound up with.

[00:22:36] Nathan:
Okay. So when you go from thinking it’s the worst business model to, you know, being the backbone of your business, you’re not wrong about it being a terrible business model, if done poorly, right? Like most of them launch, they die out. you know, the churn is crazy high. What are the, what are the changes that you had to make to, for it to go from like, not a great business model to one.

That’s incredible.

[00:23:00] Rachel:
Yeah. Well, I think The first is actually commitment. I think a lot of people do memberships because they think it’s a low commitment business model. and that is a lie friend. it is not true. And I think too, you know, people do it because they’re scared to sell something that’s more expensive. So they’re like, oh, let me sell something for $29 a month or a hundred bucks a month.

And then it won’t be as hard to sell. And this is something that I always tell my clients. I’m like, if you want $1 out of my wallet, you have to convince me, what am I getting for that dog? You know what I mean? There’s no, you don’t take away. The sales, the sales conversation has to happen, whether it’s five bucks or whether it’s $5,000 and it might be a longer conversation at the higher number, but either way, you don’t get to avoid that conversation.

And I think a lot of people are afraid to sell and so they drop their prices cause they think they can avoid having. Do a sell or do a hard sell or whatever, whatever it is that scares them about selling. They think if they drop their prices, that they get to avoid that selling conversation. And I’m like, no, no, no, no, no.

If it’s 50 cents, you got to still be like, you know, Wrigley’s gum still got to convince us like, oh, you’re going to make my breath fresh. Oh, you taste good. Oh, it’s low sugar. Right? Like you still got to convince us to buy your gum. You know what I mean? So it doesn’t matter what it is. So you might as well price accordingly and like go all in.

And I think that’s, I think the choice in the beginning is what makes so many memberships bad is that people make that decision because they want to sell something super cheap because they think it’s easier and it’s absolutely not, you know? so I think that’s the first thing. And then the other thing is it’s all about community.

You have to commit to the community. And I actually think that you’re in a better position to. You know, have success with a membership. If you already have an audience, like if you’ve been nurturing an audience over time, you can launch a community. And like we had 300 people in the first, you know, launch that we did for this.

And that was enough to give it a million dollar run rate. Right. Because also because our community is not cheap, you know, it’s 2 95 a month, which is high for a membership, you know, or, you know, some people would consider. So I think that the community is huge. You have to invest in the community and really think through like, what is the experience that they’re getting?

What is the benefit? You have to give them a customer journey, no matter what, like you can’t just throw them a bunch of courses and think that that’s enough. We certainly did that in the beginning, but then you have to create a really clear linear path to say, like, you’re going to do this first. Then you’re going to do this.

Then you’re going to do that. And here’s where you’re going to be at the end of it. And, and you know, that is key. So I think that customer journey, and I think really nurturing the community are, probably the most essential things. I don’t know that you have to have like, you know, people think, oh, I got to create new content every week.

No, you don’t. People don’t want new content every week. I think they want a clear path. They want coaching and support, you know, they want, they want to get the results. So like give them the things that are going to get them result. And if new content every week is not going to do it, don’t just create busy work for them or for you, you know?

[00:25:53] Nathan:
Yeah. So I can see where people are making the wrong promise where they’re saying in buying this, you’re going to get, you know, X, V videos every week. You know, you’re going to get this new workbook every week or like all of this. And what I hear you

Saying instead is to create the curriculum and the roadmap And say, you’re going, here’s, what’s here now. and then every week you’re going to get, or every month you’re going to get another lesson until it’s done, you know, or like until it’s built out. And then you’re just spending your time going back and improving it. But you’re very deliberate about where you’re going with the curriculum, rather than just saying, like I made this hamster wheel.

So I guess I’m going to keep running on it.

[00:26:30] Rachel:
Exactly. It’s like it actually implemented. And when I was writing my book, I, I was working with a writing coach and one of the things she said to me, he was like, you know, it’d be cool, like in the appendix as if you gave them, like, what are like, what if you gave them like a hundred steps to a seven figure business and like showed them how to do it.

And I tried to create that. And I was like, I feel like it’s too complicated. Cause actually it’s not super linear. It’s very circular. Like you’re slowly going up. Not necessarily this way with different steps that are. So then I started thinking through that and that wound up becoming the gross scale. So we have something called the Hela seven gross scale that literally tells them all right, your zero to 25 K.

Here’s what you do at this stage. Okay. Now you’ve gotten $2,000 a month in recurring revenue. Great. Now you’re at 25 to 50. Here’s what’s important at this stage because I think we see what our peers are doing and we see what our friends are doing. They’re completely different stages of business than us.

And we’re like, oh, I want to go. Stop. That’s not what you need to do at this point. Stop doing that. That’s a waste of your time, you know? and so like telling them what to do when like, basically exactly what I did with small business bodyguard, but in business. Cause I’m like, nobody does this and we need that.

We just want a roadmap, give it to us. You know? So I created a course that is that roadmap. And we expect people to be like three to six months at every stage. And so like our goal is that our customers stay with us for three years and go from literally zero to seven figures, and then, graduate, I guess, and go beyond, seven figures at that point.

But that that’s the goal. And so we’re not dropping new content every week. We’re just, they’re just working their way through the path that we’ve already laid out, asking questions, getting coaching calls, getting social calls, you know, being a part of this, you know, membership directory so that they, they get clients through it, you know?

And so that’s the path it’s not about like 52 weeks of this or a hundred hours of video. Like when people put that in a sales page, Kill me now. I don’t want to watch a hundred hours of anything except maybe succession. You know what I mean? I kind of want to watch that. So, don’t give them more, give them as little, like, what is the minimum amount of stuff you could give them for them to get an incredible result.

That is the key. Don’t give them anything more. Just give them what they need to make the money or to whatever, like build the muscle or whatever it is, the result that you’re promising. Give them the minimum, minimum effective dose. That’s what we want.

[00:28:53] Nathan:
Yeah, I love it. Okay. How do you think about, the brand that you’ve built, Write of positioning, hello, seven and it being so different from what most coaches would do, you know, and building a whole brand around a country and business.

[00:29:07] Rachel:
Yeah. it’s so interesting. Like I have been saying literally, I don’t know, I guess five years, this is not the Rachel Rodgers show. Like, this is what I say to my team all the time. How can we make this not the Rachel Rodgers show? You know, I think a lot of people want it to be the, their name show. And I don’t because I have kids and other businesses I want to build and I have amazing people on my team and I want them to shine.

And I also realize that for something to be scalable, it can’t be tied to my labor. You know what I mean? Like if

I, and I want this to, like, I want this business to exist, if I’m not here, you know what I mean? and so I always wanted to have a brand that, you know, spoke to people and was exciting. And that’s what I learned from small business bodyguard.

Right? Like having a powerful brand that speaks to, you know, the result that people want, you know, that’s what I wanted to create. And so that’s why, you know, we came up with hello, seven, cause it’s all about. Getting to that point where you can say hello, seven figures. Right. And so that was the goal and making it fun and feel light rather than heavy and hard because building a seven-figure business feels heavy and hard.

And so how can we make it lighter? How can we make the process more fun? You know? how can we connect you with people that like your, you, you find your people, you know, all of that was a part of it. So now I’m at this place where I am actually not in the day-to-day, so I’m barely in slack anymore. and I have leaders in place now that are making the decisions in the business.

I just, you know, my operations director is now COO. We just hired a new ops director. And so like, I literally, they just kicked me out of the leadership team channel. Tier, I felt a little sad about, cause they’re like, you don’t need to be involved in every conversation. Like we’ll pull you in when we need you.

And so like, there is a certain amount of oversight I’m still involved. I’m still the CEO, but I am not making decisions all day every day for the business, like I used to and I’m letting other people run the show and it is absolutely magical. So it’s like finally it’s really not the Rachel Rodgers show anymore. It took a little while, but we got there.

[00:31:13] Nathan:
Yeah, I love it. And what I’ve seen you know about the brand is that it has all these attributes that I know about you like your values, your personality, you know, so many of the things are, are built into the brand, but most people do that. Like the brand is them. and I guess I’m not articulating it very well, but, but you’ve done it where the brand has all of your attributes and values built into it without needing you to be there along with it.

Like it’s lasting much

[00:31:43] Rachel:
Exactly. Yes, because listen, if you have a clear mission statement, like we have a clear mission, and this is the key thing about the offers too. If you’re creating 50,000 offers for 12 different audiences all the time, even your team will be confused about what, what are we selling? Why are we here? What are we doing?

What’s the point? And so if you have a clear offer, a clear mission, Clear brand values that you can express to your team. Then you’re hiring people who already have those values, right? Like I don’t, I don’t try to teach people my values. They have those values. That’s why they want to join the team. Right.

I can teach them skills, but I’m not going to teach them values. Values is something that you inherently have. Right. It’s part of our core. So I find my people team wise. And so they share the same value. So it’s of course it’s like it’s part of the brand because we all have the same shared values. We’re all in the same mission.

This mission is important to all of us. And so we’re all using that as a filter to make the day-to-day decisions and the business. and I think that’s how you kind of build a brand that can have your personality, share your values, you know, have a, a key mission, but you don’t have to be there every day. This is true for a more entrepreneurs than they realize. If the key thing is you have to do, what’s scary, which is literally walk away. You have to exit slack. You have to like, you know, stop talking. Don’t come to every meeting and just start going to meetings and not talking. I have this post-it, stop talking in meetings that I keep on.

My, you know, desktop because all last year, that was my mission. Like, let other people lead. I say this to myself all the time, let them do it. You’ve hired smart people, let them do it, you know? So then I just sit back and let them do it and then try not to talk too much. Try not to direct everything. Try not to make all the decisions when people come to me and they’re like, I don’t know, should we do this? Or should we do this? I’m like, what do you mean. And then hear what they say and almost like that sounds good to me. Let’s do that

[00:33:35] Nathan:
Right.

[00:33:36] Rachel:
And just let them lead and let them have the experience of building the business. I think we just have to let go. And also, like, are you building something that is like a tribute to your person or your ego, because you’re going to back yourself into a wall eventually, and eventually you’re going to want out and there’s no way out if it’s, you know, There’s a lot of entrepreneurs out there that Amy Porterfield’s a perfect example, which has, she has an incredible business.

That’s also an eight figure business, as far as I know. And you know, it’s Amy porterfield.com. Like I wonder what is the exit strategy for that kind of thing? You know? And of course, you know, she’s in a different place than me, you know, than me in life. Like I got a lot of kids. I definitely want free time.

You know, I want to not build something that requires me. So, and I just, you know, I see this as something that could be a nine figure business and that’s what we’re trying to build it to. And we’re not going to do that with everything reliant on me, making the decisions. Like that’s just not possible.

There is a certain point in which you can’t grow beyond that. If you are in the day-to-day all day as much, you’re going to have your brilliant ideas. You’re going to help other people lead when you are out and seeing from the outside, looking in and being able to support in that way. Instead of being in everything, making all the decisions, got your face everywhere, you know,

[00:34:51] Nathan:
Yep. I’ve made many of the same moves and ConvertKit though I’m going to also do the same stop talking in meetings, sticky. Cause that that’s a good one. So in that path to a nine figure business, you’re going to need the audience to grow like your top of funnel to grow substantially.

And so something that I’m curious about and I think a lot of other creators are, is how a book and then PR plays into all of that because you don’t necessarily need your book in order to grow your business, right.

Your business was doing just fine, before we should all be millionaires came out. So I want to know like what’s the strategy there, why the book and then how it plays into the longterm vision for Hello Seven.

[00:35:36] Rachel:
Yeah, I think, well, first of all, I wrote the book because I had something to say, you know, and I was curious about it. I felt like it was a big sweeping argument and I wanted to make it in a big way. Like, I didn’t want it to just be like a YouTube video or a podcast episode. And I probably did, we shall be millionaires as that a million times, you know, in some version, but I wanted to make a bigger statement and I wanted to reach more people.

Right. I wanted more people out there to know that we exist and that we’re available to help them. And I just wanted to make the argument that women and people of color like making money is actually not as hard as we all talk about it being. And I wanted it to feel easy to them. Like I wanted them to realize like you have skills and abilities right now today that you can monetize and make a whole bunch more money this year and here’s the formula to do it.

And here’s why it’s important from like a, you know, public policy standpoint, this is why it’s important that you do it because how are we going to elect leaders that reflect who we are, right. If we don’t have money to back them, right? How are we going to build the schools that we want to build or build the kinds of organizations that we want to build?

If we have no money, money is an important tool, right? That can fuel change. And so to me, a big part, like I’m making the argument in the book, that business is a social justice tool, right? Like you can build a successful business and use it as a tool to create more social justice in the world. Right. And to create more equity in the world.

And so that’s the argument that I wanted to make and I wanted people to feel it and get fired up and then say, okay, now you’re with me. Here’s how to do it. So that’s why I decided to do the book. Cause I, I that’s, that’s harder to do there’s something to be said for long form content. Right? Like we are, we’re so used to.

Tweets and, you know, snippets on Instagram and like even short newsletters. But I think there’s something to be said for making a longer argument and putting a lot of research in there. My legal background, you have to back up everything that you say to a judge. And so I’m accustomed to like having to do a lot of research.

I can’t just say whatever I want and pull it out of my ass, you know?

And so like that, all of that, it builds a huge amount of trust from a strategic perspective. It builds a lot of trust. You’ve gotten past a big gatekeeper, which is a publisher, you know, you’re in Barnes and noble, which is a trusted store.

Right. and so I think you know, and you have somebody with you for 200 pages versus, you know, for 2000 words. Right? And so I think with that, people really get to know you where you come from your story, your point of view. And then from there, they’re very excited to work with you if they feel aligned.

[00:38:13] Nathan:
Yeah. So what, what’s the result from the book then? Do you launch it two years ago? Is that right? When did it come

[00:38:20] Rachel:
The book came out May 4th, May 4th, 20, 21. and the reason it feels like two years ago. Yes. And I, I think it feels like two years because I started promoting it like six months or like maybe almost a year ahead. I mean, it literally dropped on the pre-order page was up in July, 2020. And so from then on, I was hollering about this book and I really turned up the dial, like towards the end of 2020.

And so, I mean, I didn’t shut up about this to the point that I literally burned myself out, which people told me I would. And I was like, you don’t know me. I got all the energy in the world. And then of course I did,

[00:38:58] Nathan:
Oh yeah.

[00:38:59] Rachel:
But it was very successful. So I, I’m not, I’m not mad about it.

[00:39:04] Nathan:
Yeah. So what were the goals that you set for the book and then how did it measure up against those goals and how has it affected the business? Long-term longterm sensor.

[00:39:12] Rachel:
Yeah. I mean, the business has grown exponentially it’s wild and you know, it was interesting. Like there was a point in my career where I, like there were podcasts that I wanted to be on, or I always wanted to be in the New York times or like, you know, there’s like, media that you like wish list media that you want to get. and all of that came to fruition and it’s so funny. Like I had to check myself during the process. Cause you know, when you’re on like recording podcast, number 48 in 30 days, you know, you’re like your energy’s waning, but like I’m talking to you know, lovey or chase Jarvis or whatever, getting a feature in the New York times. and It’s like, okay, let’s be grateful because there was a time where this is everything that you wish for, even though you’re frigging tired right now. Like this is amazing, you know? so yeah, I think. That’s one of the things is if you have a book to launch, then you definitely have something to talk about in the press. Right? And so that creates a lot of opportunity for creating media. You’ve you’ve written a book, you have a point of view, what is this book about? Who’s it for? What’s the result that people are going to get after reading it. And so you can talk about that in all different forms of media. and so that’s kind of exciting, right?

It’s something to have a press release about. Right. And so I think that’s, that’s part of it. Our goal was to my goal is to sell 10 pre-order 10,000 books. and then I probably had a number in my mind of total books to sell, which I don’t even remember what it was. and you know, all the things that we did, we actually fell short.

We sold 6,000 books. I want to say in terms of, hardcovers, because only hardcovers count for bestseller list. So that’s really what I was focused on. Although my audience being the entrepreneurs that they are, we’re obsessed with the audio book, the audio book, Exceeded all expectations. And can I tell you it was miserable sitting here at my desk, in my office for like days recording it by myself, me being my very extroverted self sitting here, talking to myself and having to annunciate every word that was a miserable process.

And it did way better than, you know, the hardcover or the Kindle. Like we were on the audible best books of 2021. I mean, it was the, the audio book has been insane, but, but, but the hardcovers, we sold 6,000 and I wanted to sell 10 and I really, I wanted it to be a New York times bestseller, like probably most authors and we didn’t hit that.

And I was, I was deeply disappointed. And so that was a process. I honestly grieved that because it’s something that I was like working towards for almost a year, probably two years, I guess, if you count writing the book, and it didn’t happen and it’s possible that it will. I mean, the book is actually now picking up steam.

That’s the other thing about long form content. It is so much more timeless. I feel like, like people will keep discovering it. You’ve moved on with your life. You’re already working on book number two and people are still discovering this book and they’re still getting excited about it and Fired Up. So I feel like it really creates a lasting marketing know.

A piece of content that will generate business for you for years to come. And we put a little promo, like we have a little promo for the club in the back of the book, so people read it and they’re like, is the club open? I want to join the club. And they’re like banging down my door and my DMS, they discover it.

And it’s done well at the beginning of the year. So like, that’s good to know. You kind of got to know your seasons as an entrepreneur or like as a business owner. Right. What are the seasons that my customers are ready to go? And the beginning of the year is definitely one as well. So I think it’s, I think it’s a great tool and I highly recommend it, especially if you’ve got something to say, you

[00:42:40] Nathan:
Yes. Yeah. Please don’t write a book. If you don’t have anything to say,

[00:42:43] Rachel:
Please.

[00:42:44] Nathan:
We don’t

Need that. on the, the PR side, something that I’ve often noticed is that, you know, for, I show whether it’s a good morning America or whatever else, right. Or podcasts, but, but especially TV, most producers don’t think, you know, let’s have this, let’s have this blogger on or this podcast, or let’s have them on, like, it doesn’t S slot into any of their predefined narratives of who should be a guest on their show, but books like instantly change that.

And so I’m curious how, like, your, your PR experience from, you know, pre-book versus the book launch. And now that process afterwards, cause now I feel like I see you on, you know, on TV, you know, on these segments. Honestly, I see them on Twitter mostly, but you know, like pretty often, like, I think you had good, morning, America come out this week.

Is that right? Last week, sometime

[00:43:34] Rachel:
Yeah, that was last week. Yeah, and I mean, that’s a process. I think we first talked to good, good morning, America reach out to us when we were doing the town hall, two years ago. and we were talking to them literally and kept that conversation going myself and my, my publicist and mainly my publicist.

And then I was on GMA three and then finally, good morning. And it. Five minutes, five minutes on ABC that I didn’t have to pay for. That was essentially an incredible commercial for my business, which is not what I was expecting. I thought I was going to come on and give financial tips. And they were like, no, we want to share your client’s stories.

We want to showcase their results. We want to talk to you. But we had a prerecorded interview. Then there was a live interview and it turned into this longer thing that is incredible, you know? but that, that requires consistency, like with all things, results come from consistency, you know? And so from the town hall, like once, you know, that video that I had that went viral in 2020, where I was raging against, you know, entrepreneurs who have a lot of, you know, black people in their audience, I didn’t care, you know, when horrible things are happening to black people in public.

And so me just talking about that, cause I was pissed and I really was recording it just for like friends, you know, entrepreneurs that I know wound up going viral. And from there I was like, well, I don’t want this to just be me talking about what other entrepreneurs are doing wrong. I want there to be some positive from it.

And so we decided to do the town hall that you joined me on. and then from there is when a lot of PR happened after that. I hired a publicist during that time because I was getting so many incoming requests and I didn’t know what was legit and what wasn’t. And I didn’t really have the time to vet it all.

So I hired a publicist at that time. which was like, you know, it’s like five grand a month, so it’s a significant cost. I think there are, you know, you can hire someone for a little less, but it is a significant cost to have somebody else handling all your PR for you. but yes. So since then I have had the same publicist and we’ve just pitched lots of different things.

And we got to, honestly, I did get a decent amount of press beforehand, but it’s like the key thing is, and I think this is important for content creators of all kinds, whether it’s PR or something else is tapping into, what does the public care about right now? Like what is in the diet guys right now?

What is pressing right now? What’s on people’s minds and how can you connect the work that you do, or the things that you write about to what is happening in the world right now? That’s what PR teaches you, how to do. and that’s really all they’re doing is like, we’re talking about the great resignation right now.

Great. What do you have to say? That’s unique about that? then you can get on TV, right? Like, but if you don’t have something to say that is timely and that matters to a large portion of the public right now, it’s just not going to connect and it’s not going to, you know, get as far as you would like it to get.

So I think that’s really the key. And so, you know, obviously we’re talking about, you know, Diversity and equity and inclusion. We were talking about racial justice a lot in 2020 and through to 2021. And so that’s what I was talking about. I was talking about entrepreneurship as a vehicle, for equality, et cetera.

So, and, and they knew I had a book coming out. So I would say yes to a lot of things, because I was building those relationships with those publications, with those podcasters, with those media channels. And then, you know, when we had the book launch, we just went back to those same people and then had all of those podcasts dropping, you know, right before the book came out.

So I think it’s about building relationships and I think it’s about being consistent and, and being relevant to whatever is going on in the world right now.

[00:47:06] Nathan:
Yeah. I think that that last part is huge and I’ve seen a lot of people. well, the first example that comes to mind is, when Jeff Bezos became the richest man in the world for the first time. Right. You know, because stock prices and market caps jumped around the guys over at base camp, David NMR, Hanson, and Jason freed chose that moment to write about how Jeff Hayes’s had invested in their business 10 years earlier or something like that.

Right. And that was true. Had been true for a long time. They’ve written about it before, but because they dropped it on the same day that everyone wanted to talk about Bezos, then it became newsworthy and it got picked up by a bunch of people. And so it was just like looking at their business and saying, what is. you know, what’s our experience or any of that and how do we make it relevant? And that’s something that I

[00:47:51] Rachel:
Yes.

[00:47:52] Nathan:
Know, everyone who’s in the press is doing that, like that translation all the time.

[00:47:57] Rachel:
Exactly. And I think as creators, we have to know how to do that. Even your weekly newsletter or the podcast that you’re about to drop, like, or your Twitter thread, right? Like you want to be talking about something that is useful for people, and that is relevant for them and top of mind. Right. And that’s why a lot of people will use it.

Celebrity drama that’s unfolding, you know, and use that as the basis, you know, somebody dies and every estate lawyer that I know is using, you know, what’s happening with their estate, right. As an example of what not to do or what to do or whatever, right? Like that’s a perfect example of how you can sort of tap into whatever is going on in the world right now.

So I think we all need to learn how to do this. And I think it just takes a little bit more time, right? Like as creators, we need time to think, like sometimes we’re just so busy or saying yes to everything and it’s like, you got to give yourself spaciousness, go for walks, like go work out. Right. I have my best ideas when I’m on my Peloton, you know?

So I think we got to give ourselves a little bit more space to like strategize and think things through and just be in the world because that’s where our best ideas are going to come. And that’s when you create those connections. Cause sometimes what we do, we feel like is completely irrelevant to what’s going on in the world right now.

But not necessarily not, if you think it through and strategize, you can come up with connections that matter. Right.

[00:49:15] Nathan:
Yeah, absolutely. Okay. One thing that I want to talk about that is top of mind for both of us, or like I shared passion for both of us is one helping, entrepreneurs and creators get to a point where they are financially independent or, you know, earning a full-time living, but then there’s sort of this void of, okay, you made it to a hundred thousand dollars a year, maybe in take home or whatever.

All your financial needs are met. but like now what we were talking beforehand about how, you know, you have a podcast that you want to start on this, like if that ever happens, I would love to jam on that more.

I have a newsletter. That’s just about this topic of like, what do you do with money? What do you, you know, what are the things that change? So I’m curious for you, what are the things that as you’ve gone from, you know, trying to earn a living and then grow a business, and then it gets to the point where you’re like, wow, this is successful beyond whatever I expected. How has your relationship to money changed and in what you do with all of this new money?

[00:50:17] Rachel:
Yeah, well, you know, what’s so interesting. Probably the most revolutionary thing that I’ve done this month is, is, take Stripe off my phone, literally for the first time in 11 years or however long, like whatever merchant account I was using, I was obsessed with getting those dings, checking it multiple times a day, like, you know, gotta know what’s going on, revenue wise.

And I was like, I think I’m ready to let this go. I don’t need to check this. This is not a KPI that I hold anymore. Like my team’s got it. And I’m just, I can get a weekly update and that’s fine. Like, I don’t feel so bad. And that, that speaks to financial security, I think because, you know, I’ve been checking my bank account every day since.

Really broke 20 year old. You know what I mean? Who’s like, oh no, I’m about to go overdraft, you know, like, like, on the brink of overdraft 24 7. So like keeping a close eye, you know, and like, oh, please don’t let that come out until tomorrow or whatever it was.

So I think I just, I don’t, I think that’s the beauty of it.

It’s like once you have. Financial security and a good amount of money. You get to stop thinking about money all the time, you know, like creates a freedom for you, which is amazing, you know? so that feels really good. And now what I think about is like, what do I want to do? You know? Cause I don’t just have to, I don’t have to do things I can want to, do things.

So I think about what do I want to do? What do I want to buy or invest in? and so that’s, and then just opportunities come your way and you say yes or no to them, that’s it. So I’m doing all the things I’m investing in the stock market. I, you know, thanks to you. I’ve learned about like that margin loan strategy that I’m currently obsessed with now, that I’ve used it yet, but now I’m like, oh, I gotta put more money in the stock market.

So putting money in the stock market and You know, buying real estate, which my financial advisor would like me to stop. and I have a note about financial advisors who we should talk about, but, but then the other thing is, an investing in other companies I’ve invested in three companies now, and it’s really like, that feels very exciting to be like, oh, I don’t just have to build a company myself.

I could just put money into another company that’s already going. I don’t got to do all the work, you know?

[00:52:30] Nathan:
From there.

[00:52:32] Rachel:
Exactly, exactly. So, so that’s exciting too. I don’t think I’m going to do a huge amount of that, but like, if, if something comes my way and it seems amazing and I’m excited about, and believe in the founder, I’ll do it, you know?

[00:52:44] Nathan:
Yeah.

[00:52:44] Rachel:
So that’s kinda what I’m doing with my money and just live in my life, you know, just like, enjoying my life and enjoying my money, not just saving it. Cause you know, I get to this place where I see conversations, I’m obsessed with this fat fire Reddit. Do you follow that?

[00:52:57] Nathan:
Oh yes, I have. For years since.

[00:52:59] Rachel:
Oh, I love it. It’s so good.

The conversations are so good and so relevant to what we’re talking about right now. But I think there is sort of an existential crisis that can come once you have enough money to be like, okay, I’m putting all this money in the stock market and I’m investing in all of this And I want to just keep propagating more money.

And at some point it’s like, what is the point? You know, like, why are we doing this? I’m secure. My kids will be secure already. So like, what is the purpose? I think we can sort of lose sight of that when we don’t actually enjoy our lives or don’t actually enjoy our money. So I think that’s really important to enjoy your money, you know, and not just put every single penny of it aside for some future that you may not have tomorrow is not promised.

And I think we all learned

[00:53:40] Nathan:
Right. Yeah, there’s a, there’s a Twitter thread that I put in my newsletter at one point, because it was a. My friend saying, what was it he’s like, I need to, I only need a hundred thousand dollars a year or a hundred thousand dollars a year covers all of my family expenses. Everything else gets packed into my snowball and rolled downhill.

Which one? I really liked that mindset because that’s how you build wealth. Like, you know, invest in the next thing rather than inflating your lifestyle. But then I loved the first reply to it, which was at the bottom of the hill. Everyone’s dead. And no one needs the money of like,

[00:54:16] Rachel:
Exactly.

[00:54:17] Nathan:
You know, like you died just the same and you know, and so like living in the intersection between those two worlds is where I love to spend time.

And so like a couple of things for me. well, like I haven’t, I need to write like a full long form blog post about it, but we sold a little bit of ConvertKit stock, you know? And you were one of the people who, who, bought a substantial portion of it, Which is a substantial portion of what was sold, not a substantial portion of the company. and, and that just enabled like a different mindset around money. So one thing is like I was able to retire my parents and that w my, my parents, I have three sets cause my parents remarried and all of that. So my parents, my parents, and all of that. And like, that was a huge thing. And just realizing like, oh, there’s this abundance of money or this amount of money, isn’t going to make a substantial difference for me.

[00:55:11] Rachel:
Yes.

[00:55:12] Nathan:
Especially like this year and next year, these next few years, where they can quit working, you know, three to five years earlier, like

[00:55:20] Rachel:
Yes. Those moments are so rewarding. I just had that moment with my sister, my son, my nephew, got into all these private schools and he’s doing so amazing.

And she’s like, okay, you got it. And now I have to figure out how to pay for it. And I’m like, we’re going to cover it.

And she just started crying and I was just like, this is why I make money for this moment right here.

You know what I hate?

[00:55:41] Nathan:
Yup. It’s so good. And then the other thing is, I think a money thing or like a new money thing for a lot of creators is that they might have, money come in big waves. Right? If you do a

Product launch, it, it makes a hundred thousand dollars all at once. And there’s the unsavvy side of it, right. Where someone’s like, look at all this money and then like the next month, they’re like, why am I broke?

But I think a lot of creators are savvy. And so they’re like, okay, I’m going to roll this forward. I’m going to invest in this thing and, and all of them. And I like to have a rule that when you have these spikes of revenue and you’re making far more than you need that you have to spend. At least 5% of it, if not 10 on a splurge of some kind where you’re like, this is ridiculous.

I can not justify it in any way. It’s something that I’ve always wanted, you know, whatever that is. like one of our first splurges was a

Fox, right? Of like this isn’t going to make money. It isn’t, you know, like any of that. And so, and then like another splurge that we’re going to do this year is rent a private jet to go to a, a sailing trip, you know?

And so it’s those

[00:56:46] Rachel:
Love it.

[00:56:46] Nathan:
Justify it in any way. Other than that, it fits within my rule of the five

[00:56:52] Rachel:
Yes.

[00:56:53] Nathan:
That has to be spent. And it’s way more fun.

[00:56:55] Rachel:
Exactly. Yes. And, you know, we do the same thing. I think, I think it’s important to remember that, like, if you don’t celebrate those wins, at some point, you’re, you’re going to be like, why am I doing this? Because it’s going to be hard. There’s going to be lots of valleys for those Hills. Right? So you have to have something to keep you going and to remind you why you committed to this work anyway, you know, and to like celebrate your wins.

Like for us hitting our eight figures for our first year, our Spillers was, we went to jumpy bay resort, which is in Antiga, it’s a private island, you know, it’s mostly billionaires that own homes there. And we went for a week and just ridiculously expensive vacation. And we absolutely loved it. I brought my niece with me and you know, my kids and my husband.

Fantastic time and made all these incredible memories that we’ll never forget, you know? And now I’m like, okay, I think I’m going back. I looked at so much, I’m going to need another splurge moment,

[00:57:54] Nathan:
Well, the good thing about eight figure business that’s recurring revenue is you hit that eight figures every year.

[00:57:59] Rachel:
Exactly. Yes.

[00:58:02] Nathan:
It, but here for you.

[00:58:04] Rachel:
Well, thank you. Thank you very much. I appreciate that. Exactly. I just, I almost feel like I was telling my husband the other day, I’m like, I think we need an investment thesis. Cause there’s so much opportunity that comes our way. And it’s like, not just an investment thesis, but like a money thesis in general.

Like what is our money thesis? Like what is, what is important to us? What are we going to spend our excess money on? You know, how are we going to use it? How are we going to not use it?

So that way we can sort of filter our decisions about what we’re doing with money. And I think we already have it.

It’s just not captured. It’s not written down, you know? but I agree. And I think so many entrepreneurs, you know, even if you’re making $200,000 or $500,000 a year, right? Like, like you said, it’s recurring it’s every year. You’re going to make that. And maybe more if you keep consistently growing this business.

So like make sure that you’re putting money aside for the future, make sure that you’re investing, make sure that you’re enjoying some of it. And I think too, So I’m going to say this. I don’t listen to my financial advisor. I don’t know that that’s necessarily good advice for everybody, but for me, I, you know, my financial, I have two of the, actually three for different things, but I have a financial advisors that, I think they’re very conservative.

I think they, you know, every year I’m like, here’s how much we’re going to make. And they’re like, well, let’s only plan for this. And I’m like, have you met me? What have I not hit my goals? You know what I mean? Like I’m like, what is this? And that’s the thing. It’s like, I can not have somebody in my ear doubting.

When I am out here trying to do important work and you’ve reached big goals, you know what I mean? And so, like, my husband mostly talks to our financial advisors. I don’t get on the phone with them too often because I feel like they’re almost so conservative that they can like kill my vibe and no matter how much money we make, they, they get, you know, they get on with us and act like we’re poor, you know?

No matter what they’re like, well, we have no money because this isn’t, this I’m like, there’s actually this much excess still. And they’re like, well, we can’t spend that. You know? so I listened to them and I follow their advice, like their tax strategies and putting money away and investing in all of that.

And then I do what I want, you know, because if it was up to them, I would spend absolutely nothing. and so I feel like you got to temper that when you’re an entrepreneur, like you’re not a W2 employee, it’s different. And I think you have to make sure that you have people around you who are reflecting what you are capable of and not poo-pooing your ideas.

And I think sometimes financial advisors play that role a little too well. So that’s my advice. Not advice.

[01:00:36] Nathan:
Yeah, I like that one. I think that so much of like the way that you and I think is a lot more of using our money to buy another asset, to reinvest in the business

[01:00:48] Rachel:
Yes.

[01:00:49] Nathan:
And so it’s often important to have that reminder to say like, no, no, no. Spend some of the money on yourself on, on these splurges.

[01:00:56] Rachel:
Yes. Exactly. Exactly. Enjoy your money and spend your money in ways on yourself, because you are your biggest asset, right? You are, what’s generating all of this wealth. So like how can you take care of yourself and put yourself in positions to be inspired? Like. Going on that vacation that was pricey.

I came back with all these different ideas and knowing what I want my next book to be about. All of these different things that you get when you take that private jet trip, or when you go sailing. You’re going to come up with all these solutions to problems, or new ideas for ways to make money.

Those investments are smart, but from a financial advisor’s perspective you should never spend that money. It’s like, you don’t understand. I am a growing asset. Think of me like a stock market ticker. My price is going up, but we got to invest in me for my price to go up.

That’s an important piece of it, too. Obviously

[01:01:53] Nathan:
Yeah.

[01:01:53] Rachel:
Your money. It’s important that we do that. I think most of us do not.

[01:01:59] Nathan:
Yeah. I think we’ll get someone in here who thinks of talking about money in this way. It’s bragging in some way, but I always love to have conversations like this because it’s conversations that I heard years ago that made me go, “Oh, that’s possible.”

[01:02:15] Rachel:
Yes, exactly.

[01:02:17] Nathan:
How I should think about it? I raised my goals and set my sights higher. And because of that…

[01:02:23] Rachel:
Yes,

[01:02:24] Nathan:
I achieved some pretty incredible results. I think the same is true for you.

[01:02:27] Rachel:
For sure. I literally walk around with a necklace that says “Rich bitch.” Part of it is because I had somebody from my audience, who was actually a client, who was like, “Stop talking about how much you have.” I’m like, “I honestly don’t think I do that on Instagram or whatever all that much, but I will never stop talking about it because people need to see a black woman in the world building her own wealth, and making it happen just from the ideas in her brain.” Nothing else, you know what I mean?

That needs to be seen a whole lot more than it currently is. So, I’m going to keep talking about it, and if you don’t like it change the channel.

[01:03:05] Nathan:
That’s amazing.

Okay. Let’s end there. Where should people go to follow you and to check out Hello Seven?

[01:03:12] Rachel:
We are at HelloSeven.co. Check out our podcast, the Hello Seven podcast. I’m on Instagram, RachRodgersEsq, and Twitter as well.

[01:03:20] Nathan:
Yep. Twitter is the less filtered version. A little bit more raw and playful.

[01:03:26] Rachel:
Yes, exactly. Exactly.

[01:03:32] Nathan:
Well, thanks so much for coming on. We’ll talk soon.

[01:03:34] Rachel:
Okay. Talk soon.